328 10 Years of Adoptees On with Haley Radke, Sullivan Summer, and Kristal Parke
/Transcript
Full shownotes: https://www.adopteeson.com/listen/328
Haley Radke: [00:00:00] This podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Nothing stated on it, either by its hosts or any guests, is to be construed as psychological, medical, or legal advice.
You're listening to Adoptees On, the podcast where adoptees discuss the adoption experience. I'm Haley Radke. I'm the creator and host of this show, which aired its first episode on July 1st, 2016, a full decade ago. When I started Adoptees On all those years ago, my teens were a toddler and a preschooler and I podcasted in a corner of my basement with a laundry rack behind me that I'd toss a quilt over top of for better sound quality.
I'd met a few adoptees on Twitter, and I wanted to have more in-depth conversations about reunion, grief, mental health, identity and [00:01:00] healing. I just didn't know that thousands of you wanted that, too. Thank you for building this show with me. This milestone moment is for every single guest who trusted me with their story, every listener who felt seen while listening, and all the folks who have supported the show, Patreon, sharing episodes with a friend, leaving me comments or reviews.
I am so deeply honored to be in community with all of you. Thank you. Today, I've invited a couple of friends to turn the microphone on me, and we run the gauntlet of tears to laughter in a very short time. I hope you enjoy. Sullivan Summer and Kristal Parke of Adoption Pop are here to celebrate 10 incredible years with us today.
Before we get started, I wanna personally invite you to sign up for my podcast newsletter, which you can find at adopteeson.com/newsletter. We [00:02:00] wrap up with some recommended resources and as always, links to everything we'll be talking about today are on the website adopteeson.com. Let's listen in. I'm so pleased to welcome back to Adoptees On Sullivan Summer.
Hello, Sullivan.
Sullivan Summer: Hello.
Haley Radke: And Kristal Park. Hi, Kristal.
Kristal Parke: Hi, Haley Radke. Hi, Sullivan Summer.
Sullivan Summer: Hi, Kristal Park.
Haley Radke: Welcome, friends.
Kristal Parke: Thank you for having us. I'm so excited to be here. Today is such a special day.
Sullivan Summer: It's an incredibly special day. How do you feel, Haley?
Haley Radke: I cannot remember the last time feeling nervous before a recording, and today I am I think I want to be able to remember all the things, and I'm fearful I will not be able to.
And that feels sad, [00:03:00] right? When it used to be when I even edited the show myself way back in the day, I knew every guest. I knew their story. I remembered everything. And now I don't anymore because there's been so many, like hundreds of people I've, had the privilege to talk to, and all of their stories are important, but I don't wanna forget something.
So I don't know. I feel this pressure to hold everything in my mental archive, which I'm pretty good at usually, but there's a lot packed in there of adoptee things now.
Sullivan Summer: Do you think there's gonna be a quiz?
Haley Radke: Yeah. Didn't you write a quiz of what was episode 262? I'm not sure.
Sullivan Summer: I feel like, so Kristal and I obviously prepared for this episode, but now I'm feeling like we did not use our prep time the way we should have.
Kristal Parke: But we did do some prep, so we're not [00:04:00] freewheeling it here.
Haley Radke: Okay. All right. I'm so glad to allow you to interview me. Did my voice shudder? That was like... yeah. No, I'm ready. I'm excited to talk about 10 years of Adoptees On.
Kristal Parke: This is big. This is big, and it's emotional. For me even, to think about the impact that Adoptees On has had on my life and the lives of so many who have shared publicly that you have impacted their journey, it's emotional. And here she goes, everyone. Haley's... I can see the emotions coming to the surface.
Sullivan Summer: What was the over-under on minutes it will take Haley to cry?
Haley Radke: If you get under three, you win.
Sullivan Summer: So Haley, at what point did you realize that this podcast was clicking [00:05:00] into something? At what point did you realize, oh, wait a minute, this is actually a thing. It's not just kinda something that you started, a personal hobby or anything like that, but this is actually, this is gonna be a thing.
Haley Radke: I think somewhere between six months to a year in of recording the stories, yes that was a thing for me. But it was when listeners started really commenting or wanting to share with me or emailing me and giving feedback. To, to your point earlier, Kristal, of "Oh, this is the first time I'm hearing these things. I feel so seen," and like that. I was like, oh, it really isn't just me having an impact from hearing these stories. It is going to be a thing. But I had no idea how big it would get really.
Kristal Parke: Was there [00:06:00] ever a moment that you felt like you were in, over your head? Whether it be an interview or when Adoptees On started to get a lot of feedback, did you ever feel like you were in over your head? What did I create here?
Haley Radke: I think I can think of two different pieces. So I never knew... I used to have seasons, and I had what I would call season one, season two kind of thing, and I never knew how many episodes I was gonna make in a season. I was just like, I- that's what you do. You call it season one and I think editing, I don't know, seven, eight I can't remember the exact number, and I was like, Ugh, I need a break. This is all so much emotions. And then listening it, to it back multiple times, make sure the edit's good, right? You're really taking in all the feelings. That was one piece where I'm like, "Okay, I gotta wrap this and have a little break." So that was one. The other was, I don't remember exactly the timing of this.
I would say it would be within the [00:07:00] first two years. I got my first really harsh critique. I don't even remember what it was now. But I took it so deeply personal, and I went to the Facebook group of listeners at the time, and I was like, "How could she say these mean things to me?" And it really kinda shook me a little bit, because to that point, all I had was good feedback.
And I've told other creators who have thought about starting a podcast this before. You don't really get a lot of bad feedback in podcasting. If you post something on Instagram, your keyboard's right there. People can tell you how ugly you look, and you shouldn't have worn that, and why do you, why did you vote for who you di- you know.
But on podcasting it takes a few steps for someone to find your show, play it, and then also to find you to give you [00:08:00] feedback. So if they do all those steps, they're ready to really lay into you. But that really was such a good experience for me now, because I think about all the terrible things people have said to me in the last, years since that.
I don't care. I just don't even care. I'm thick-skinned now. And also, we're recording this, I have a very dark burn on my arm, sunburn which has a thick demarcation line. I look like I taped off a rectangle for some reason, and I feel like it's gonna be permanent. So that's where my thick skin is, right there.
Sullivan Summer: So it sounds like for sure getting that harsh feedback was a hard moment. Was that the hardest moment? Or if you think back over 10 years, what's, what was the hardest [00:09:00] moment?
Haley Radke: I think I've had a few. One was I was a couple of weeks out from interviewing someone, and he passed away. And I didn't even know him. I hadn't interacted with him really. I think someone recommended that he come on. I can't even remember his name at this mo- so here, that's one of those oh, shoot, I wish I knew what his name was. And I was like, "Oh, no," now his story won't be preserved for the record. And I've... and that was really difficult for me to wrap my head around.
And then when my first guest who I had on passed, Dr. Sunny Reed, that was brutal. I remember grieving for her for a really long time because she was in a doctoral program. Her research [00:10:00] was going to benefit and has benefited adopted people in a large way, and I knew her future and trajectory. And so when she died, it was so devastating.
So those hard moments, I think, were all community related when I think of the other items 'cause I don't know how... I guess I feel like I'm like a adoptee historian collecting all these stories and trying to preserve them forever and highlighting the books and articles that adoptees have added to the collection of our stories and the documentary.
Like, all those things I wanna be the collector. There used to be this thing called the Adoption Museum Project, and ultimately that shuttered. But I was like is this the new digital adoption museum of, oral histories and that kind of thing? Anytime something's lost, that was [00:11:00] really hard for me.
Yeah. It's not necessarily podcast related, but that's just me being in this space more.
Kristal Parke: Yeah, that makes sense. And of course, loss, it's a theme in us, in our, us adoptees', our lives, right? And yeah to lose a story or a life or any of that's a lot. It's a lot. Do you wanna come up for air and for me to ask you something a little lighter?
Haley Radke: Sure.
Kristal Parke: Okay. What do you wear from the waist down? Are you wearing shorts, granny panties, slippers, socks?
Haley Radke: I'm always wearing underwear. I'm always wearing pants. Occasionally a skirt. I will definitely wear shorts in the summertime, but... And I'm 98% of the time barefoot, and that might be [00:12:00] surprising 'cause I hate feet, but I choose to be barefoot. Yeah.
Kristal Parke: I love the format of Adoptees On because we don't... it's not video, right? And so there's a real casual comfortability about recording with you. I do appreciate that.
Haley Radke: You know what? I remember one guest, I think his name was Bernie, and he wasn't really public adoptee. I can't recall exactly how we got connected to have him on the show, but he showed up in a suit, and he was ready and it was... I remember just being, like, so struck by that. He's taking this very seriously, and he's very prepared, and he had a full suit on.
Kristal Parke: Oh, Bernie.
Haley Radke: Yeah.
Kristal Parke: I love that.
Sullivan Summer: That makes me feel that makes me feel warm inside.
Kristal Parke: Me too. I think.
Haley Radke: Oh, that's 100% how I took it ... yeah. Yes. Yeah, 100%. Yeah. It... And that's such a good memory for me.
Kristal Parke: [00:13:00] Wow. I just wanted to say, it... we do this, and Haley, you've been doing this now for 10 years, and I think we can get a little desensitized to just this whole experience. But for some people, it's their very, maybe their one and only time that they ever share their story, and it means a great deal to people. And I know it means a great deal to you as well. I certainly don't think you take that for granted.
Haley Radke: Yeah, I've had some really special opportunities to be the first person someone's ever told their story out loud to. And that's such a privilege, right? What a privilege to be so trusted.
And then for them to trust you as a listener with it,
Kristal Parke: yeah,
Haley Radke: so special. And so I've had times where [00:14:00] I've had open-to-guest applications, and I think folks get a little bit salty sometimes when, with some of my questions or they're like I don't have a platform or I wanna be anonymous. She's not gonna take me. Absolutely, I will. Absolutely. It's not about who has the biggest following. I wish I could interview everyone. I wish everyone's story could be preserved for all of us to learn from.
Sullivan Summer: So Kristal and I can see you in this conversation, and we can see you tearing up and getting emotional just thinking about some of the guests that you've had over the past 10 years. Can you share some of the most unforgettable on-air moments?
Haley Radke: I remember one, one gal we had on who shared about how she snuggled up with her birth mother every [00:15:00] night for months, and would lay... They would lay together. I think she described it as laying on top of her somet- like, and I thought, "Oh, my gosh. I'm so glad you said that out loud." She wasn't embarrassed by it, and I thought how there's gonna be many people that are like, "I wish I could climb into my birth mother's skin. I wish I could have that experience." When I was interviewing Jane for the genetic sexual attraction episode, I remember thinking like, "Wow, I'm never gonna have a conversation like this again."
The moments where people I'm gonna use the word overshare. I don't mean it that way because they're just, they're so open and vulnerable and willing to say the things that most people would keep secret, and we're so much [00:16:00] better for it. Because there's so many people who have had those experiences and have felt so completely isolated, I think... What other memorable... We've certainly had some funny moments or embarrassing moments. My favorite are when pets make an appearance even though most people are so careful to put their pets away and we're not gonna hear any jingling and And which my dog is upset with me right now. I don't know if you can hear that either. But yeah, I'm trying to think if there's any other... I don't know. I've cried with so many people, and the thing that gets me the almost every interview I always ask at the end "Is there anything that you shared that you maybe overshared 'cause you felt like you were just talking to me, a friend, but you don't really want the rest of the world to hear about this, and you want me to edit it out?" And almost everyone is "No leave it in. That's the real." And [00:17:00] so that's pretty special, too.
Kristal Parke: I don't know about you, Sullivan, but there's episodes of Adoptees On, like that one that you just mentioned about the adoptee crawling up with her birth mom, that I can remember where I was in the world listening to. And I think that is many people's experiences with Adoptees On.
Sullivan Summer: There's an episode with Pam Cordano as part it was part of the estrangement series in 2021, and I literally remember where I was on the sidewalk when I heard Pam say certain things in that episode.
Kristal Parke: I remember where I was when I first heard your episode, Sullivan. Oh. You were one of those episodes. I was I was walking on my treadmill in my basement. I can fully go back to that [00:18:00] memory, so it's the impact,
Sullivan Summer: I remember when Haley met you because she left me a voice note the day that you met and told me that she met someone special.
Kristal Parke: Aw. That's Oh my gosh. So that brings me to my next question then, which would be what are some of your favorite memories of meeting listeners in real life?
Haley Radke: Oh. That one really makes me cry. That's a, that's such a joyful thing to think about. I remember when I went to a conference in 2017 and David Boll came up to me and he told me that he had been listening to my podcast and he loved it, and I was like, "Oh my gosh."
A real life listener in [00:19:00] person. That really felt like the podcast was real and that strangers were listening, it wasn't my, 10 friends and family that I could, summon up to, even though I know, knew the numbers were higher than that, but that was a good moment.
And Nick and I went to San Francisco on a holiday, and so we had arranged to do one of Anne Heffron's writing workshops, 'cause she lived nearby at the time, and then do a listener meetup. I think, I don't know what the year that was now, maybe 2019. And I had listeners come from, I wanna say six states, traveled from out of state to, not just like local people, but traveled from out of state to, yes, visit San Francisco, and then do a writing workshop with Anne, and then hang out with me and the other [00:20:00] adoptees for the evening.
That felt really wild. Like I'm trying to think of who would I travel to hang out with that I listen to on a podcast. I don't know. And then the other really fun meetup I had was when I spoke at a conference in Washington DC and we had a listener meetup. I think there was like 30-some people there and there was like a lineup formed to meet me and take pictures with me.
And I was like, what is happening? That was wild. And that was, I tell you what, that same day, that was a, such a low moment for me because I had this peak experience. I met all these listeners, and we spent time together and took pictures, and we took a big group photo, and I don't know if I've posted that.
I should post it in with the celebration kinds of things. And that night, Nick had made [00:21:00] plans to go see a sporting event. I can't remember which kind. And everyone kinda left and filtered away and had their own dinner plans or whatever, and I was all by myself that evening in the hotel, and it felt so Oh, okay, and now I'm by myself. It was a weird swing
Kristal Parke: I think at the end of the day too, you're like, "I'm just me." I'm still just me, right? Every- I think sometimes people look at you like you're this, I don't know, this like they put you on a pedestal, right? And then at the end of the day it's no I'm still me, right?
Haley Radke: Still Haley just waiting for someone to ask her out for dinner.
Kristal Parke: There you go.
Haley Radke: Can I come to your group dinner? No. Okay. Okay, bye.
Sullivan Summer: Do you find that people have misconceptions about you?
Haley Radke: I think people think I'm... I'm gonna, I'm gonna say the thing and then I'm gonna also be like, but that's actually kinda true.
People think [00:22:00] I'm too busy or like I might not get back to them or, they want something from me and like a lot of the time I'm not too busy and I can reply to the things and I can interact for a brief time period. I'm not inaccessible, except for this year. This year I really am.
But in the normal times when I'm not working on several shows at the same time, I do comment back to listeners and I do message them and I wish I could replicate myself. But I've always hoped that when people contacted me looking for community that I could send them out outwards to build community for themselves and to make their own friendships and all those connections outside of me.
What other misconceptions? I think people think I know every single adoptee that's ever made some kind of media or book and I... someone [00:23:00] on this call might DM me regularly saying, "Do you know this person?" And I'm like, "No. I wish I did." Okay, two people on this call might do that regularly. Okay, there you go.
Now you've both outed yourselves. Sorry, they're like pointing at themselves and stuff. Yeah, I don't know everybody, I don't know every book. I continue to discover new interesting adopted people on the regular.
Kristal Parke: All right. Who are your dream guests? If you could have anybody in the world, and I won't even make you pick one, you can pick a top three.
Haley Radke: I think here's another misconception. I think people think like I want big celebrity guests on or something, but so many of them are so private and closed off and they don't wanna necessarily talk about those things. So I can name one. I'd really like to interview Sarah McLachlan. I think she would be a really fascinating adoptee interview [00:24:00] if she was willing to be public with the real, which is what the majority of my guests are willing to do, really be authentic.
And I don't think celebrities are already asked so many intimate personal questions and have so little privacy and anything to themselves that to ask them to do an interview like one of mine feels so incredibly intrusive. And like truthfully, I haven't gone after too many. I think the most famous person I've interviewed probably is Mary Gauthier, and she's been very public with her adoptee experience, so I didn't feel like I was overstepping when I was asking her my questions, so yeah.
Kristal Parke: I love Sarah McLachlan. I love her music. I grew up on that.
Haley Radke: Yeah. And she's Canadian. Come on.
Kristal Parke: Yeah. Yeah, she'd be a perfect guest.
Sullivan Summer: [00:25:00] Haley, what's been the greatest sacrifice you've had to make in bringing Adoptees On to life or continuing it over 10 years?
Haley Radke: I have a couple things going through my mind.
I was a stay-at-home mom, and this led me to be a working parent, and so I think I sacrificed time with my kids when they were young. That's a deep cost, as mothers know. And saying the things that I know deeply to be true, but can be very controversial when critiquing adoption, has cost me some relationships.
That's a tough one. And then I don't actually know if this is true or not, [00:26:00] but this is the story that I tell myself, to use that phrase, is that I think by doing this podcast, like I think it, it might have cost me a chance to reconnect with my birth mother. I'm assuming she's heard it, and that's something that I've always had in my head that's "Oh, if I do this, then this might be a bridge too far for her."
Kristal Parke: So if you could go back 10 years and know what you know now, with that in mind, but as a whole, Adoptees On as a whole, would you do it again?
Haley Radke: Yeah. It's it's changed me so profoundly. I've learned so much from my guests and my [00:27:00] listeners. I've learned so much about myself. It has pushed me to heal things I didn't know needed to be healed until somebody said something and I'm like, "Oh yes, I gotta go back to my therapist."
That happened so so many times. And I think I'm... Like I think I'm a better person now than when I started 10 years ago. I hope I've become a better human. But from the feedback I've gotten I can't... like I can't believe things people have shared with me about how the show has changed their life or... I think at this point I'm probably up to, I think I can think of maybe 15 people now who've told me that they decided to stay alive on this planet, from hearing Adoptees On. And I... who could trade that, all of every sacrifice is worth it for [00:28:00] that.
Sullivan Summer: I know I can't imagine my life without Adoptees On. I can't. It's been in my life for five years, and I can say with confidence that my life would have been not just different, but not as full if I hadn't have Googled, "Is there a podcast about adoption?" One day and found Adoptees On.
What about you, Kristal?
Kristal Parke: Yeah, I would say the same, the very same thing, and I also Googled.
I was looking for a Canadian adoptee connection and yeah, I found Adoptees On and I think the, and this is, I think this is the antithesis of what Adoptees On has done is just opened adoptees' eyes and given them the courage [00:29:00] to be able to look at their own journey And so thank you.
Sullivan Summer: Thank you.
Kristal Parke: We love you.
We love you. We love you so much.
Sullivan Summer: We love you.
Haley Radke: I love you too. Thank you. We did it. Okay, that was... I feel like I did have my answers in order. Good job, Haley, mentally prepared enough. But you two have been on my screen a lot lately because, the three of us started a whole new thing this year, which is Adoption Pop, and I would love to just get the chance to tell Adoptees On listeners about it. Sullivan, why don't you share how you came up with the idea for Adoption Pop?
Sullivan Summer: [00:30:00] I watch a lot of TV. I think so many of us where, you know, you're home, you're watching your Netflix, you're watching your YouTube, you're going to the movies, and you just get blindsided by adoptee storylines in all these films that you didn't know they were...
it was in there. And I feel like the reason I say blindsided is because it always felt like the stories were always told very poorly. And I don't recall what the most recent one that I had watched, but I had this flash of oh, we should have a podcast where we get to just talk about talk about this media really thoughtfully and really deeply with other adoptees who watch it too and just share our opinions of it.
And I reached out to the two of you, and I left a voice note, and at the time I left the [00:31:00] voice note, it was what I call a fake fantasy job. I have a lot of ideas all the time, and I sometimes will be like this is a fake fantasy, and I was like this is a fake fantasy thing.
And so I got... I just left you both a silly, long-winded voice note about we should do this, but I didn't think it was serious, and the two of you responded immediately very seriously and already were like we could do this, and it could do this. It could look like this. And I remember thinking oh, I think they're serious, and I think, I actually think I'm serious too.
Haley Radke: I've been the recipient of many of your fake fantasy Voxer messages. I didn't hear that message as a fake fantasy. I heard it as, "I'm presenting this idea that we're doing."[00:32:00]
Kristal, did- what did
Kristal Parke: Oh my I'm over here just laughing, cracking up. I've got my audio on mute because I'm laughing so hard. Yeah I didn't think that either. I thought, "Wow, this is a great idea." And I loved the opportunity to be able to create with two females and fellow adoptees, and two individuals that I have a lot of respect for.
And I just was like, "Yeah, sure." And I remember, I actually remember vox-ing you back and being like, "I don't know if I have much to offer, but I could do this."
Haley Radke: Yeah. Yeah.
Kristal Parke: That's crazy, Kristal.
Haley Radke: I think Sullivan and I are laughing because of the three of us, Kristal lifts the most for this show
Kristal Parke: I don't know
Haley Radke: next to Sullivan, and I just, roll up.
Kristal Parke: But that [00:33:00] was all predetermined. That was all predetermined because we knew that you were, taking on a big project with On Adoption, and I think both Sullivan and I were so happy to do what we could so that you could be a part of this.
Sullivan Summer: And you also come, Haley, for the production of each individual episode, which we do, we have weekly episodes, and so for the production of each individual episode, while Kristal and I are doing the lifting on those, you're coming with a decade of experience. So you have already done the work for Adoption Pop, you just did it over 10 years, what Kristal and I are doing, in these seven-day rounds.
Haley Radke: So we always watch a piece of media every week that more than not, likely more than not, [00:34:00] gets us very upset and ready to roast the creators, the writers, whoever's participating in these trashy projects. Not always, but most of the time. And so I've never watched so many things that I have just had huge angry feelings about.
I do hate watch things. I, that's true. That is true about me. I do hate watch things. Never in my life have I watched so many things I hated for the purpose of this podcast. Kristal, has it changed your viewing habits at all?
Kristal Parke: My viewing habits? How do you mean?
Haley Radke: Of any... do you view things for pleasure anymore? Or you just think, "If I have to turn the TV on, it's, I'm just gonna watch this next triggering thing and- ... have to write down all the terrible things about it so I can repeat them to Haley and Sullivan in a couple days."
Kristal Parke: Y- yeah. I feel like, there's... I'm either watching adoptee, [00:35:00] Adoption Pop content or I'm watching The Real Housewives to get my mind off of anything sort of adoptee-related, but they alway- they somehow slip it in there somehow.
There's always some sort of adoption storyline that that makes it into reality TV, too. Yeah, I don't watch TV the same way. I feel like I don't even see life in the same way after being around the two of you. You two are actually the ones that taught me what the term hate watch meant. I'd, I had never even heard of that before.
Haley Radke: I'm an expert. I'm an expert hate watcher.
Sullivan Summer: Haley is an expert hate watcher. I don't like to hate watch. I'll just shut something off, which I can't do now with Adoption Pop.
Kristal Parke: Yeah.
Sullivan Summer: But I think Adoption Pop... So I, you both know, I do a lot of literary criticism kind of outside my Adoption Pop life. And so [00:36:00] turning now to television and film criticism for me was not that big of a leap. It's just I'm taking in the media in a different way. But the podcast has really challenged me to speak thoughtfully about why I'm having the reaction that I'm having. And also- something that we were really thoughtful about when we started the podcast, because it was more than simply a voxer, we prepped, I think it was it six weeks- or so between the idea and when we recorded our first episode. So we put a lot of work in the front end, and also thinking about, what do we want this podcast to be. And we were... We have been very intentional to say we hope and assume we will have an adoptee audience, people that feel validated perhaps by... that may share our opinions of pieces of media. [00:37:00] But I think we were really conscious about perhaps wanting a broader audience to include adoptive parents and families of adoptees, whether biological or adoptive as well. Because I grew up in a family where talking about things was not really what we did.
And so I feel like I would have wished for perhaps an entree, if people are watching TV or a movie or something, to use that as the anchor point for having what is otherwise a tough conversation about the way that somebody might be feeling. And I feel like I've been challenged in the podcast to think about the language I use and how I present my own ideas, because just saying, "I hate this," is not helpful for anyone, myself included
Haley Radke: Okay, fine. That's all I did the last episode we recorded. But [00:38:00] no, I think to your point it's the Big Daddy one for anyone who wants to listen. I'm not sure if it'll be out when this airs, but-
Kristal Parke: Sullivan's "Fix your face."
Haley Radke: Yeah.
Kristal Parke: Is your face gonna be like this the whole episode?
Haley Radke: Yeah. That was my most sour episode so far.
No, wait, to your earlier point, I think we had feedback within, I wanna say, the first two to three weeks of someone saying just that. "Thank you so much for doing this episode. I was able to watch the thing and talk about it with my adoptive family," and it created those conversations that a lot of us wished we were able to have when we were growing up.
And it's also this, I'm gonna call it, like it's a sideways safe way to have a conversation. We're talking about this movie or TV show and how they're portraying adoption. We're not talking about our family or adoption, how it impacts us personally. [00:39:00] So it is like this ease into how can you have those more deeply personal conversations, which is really helpful I think anyone in relationship with an adopted person.
Kristal, who do you think should listen to Adoption Pop? And also comment to people who might not like to watch all these things we're talking about.
Kristal Parke: Yeah. One thing I think that we do really is I feel like we definitely give a very compassionate place for birth mothers to land here I think that the way that media portrays birth mothers is terrible, to say the least.
Look at we're about to do Shrinking. And I can imagine as a birth mother watching media that, oh, I don't wanna I don't wanna watch Adoption Pop because, media has done me dirty [00:40:00] already. But I think that for first mothers and and fathers for that matter to come, they can... I think they can come and watch this and really feel seen, and yeah, they should have done that differently.
I would also say non-adoptees, because I think it gives... and I have lots of friends that are not adopted, but maybe have a connection to adoption, and they watch, and then they're like, "Oh my gosh, I never thought about it that way," which is so cool 'cause that's what we're trying to do. So my answer is everyone.
But I know that, your audience can't just be everyone, but yeah. My vote is everyone.
Haley Radke: I think I agree. And I think I just wanna say that you don't have to have watched the thing-
Kristal Parke: Yeah ...
Haley Radke: to learn from our conversations and laugh with us at the creators of some of these terrible items. And [00:41:00] not everything we've covered has been terrible. We have had some gems. So you can look forward to, watching those along with us, I think.
Sullivan Summer: I think I'm always really proud and excited when someone will tell us that they went out and watched the media because we talked about it.
Haley Radke: Yes.
Sullivan Summer: They had never watched it before, and so now they went and watched it. And some of those have been things that we were very harsh about.
Haley Radke: Yeah.
Sullivan Summer: Others, people have watched after we've said very positive things about them. And I think we should also say that the three of us don't always agree- on depictions, on, there are some pieces of media that, that one or two of us are incredibly activated by. And one or two of us had no problem with it, maybe even enjoyed it and other times where we disagree about the depiction [00:42:00] of whichever characters.
And again, I'm proud of that as well because I think, we represent different backgrounds and different life experiences and some of those overlap and some of them don't. And we also don't represent every adoptee experience either. And so I'm hopeful that listeners and viewers, 'cause we're on YouTube as well, but listeners and viewers of Adoption Pop can see something in every episode that resonates with them
Haley Radke: Agreed. Adoption Pop is definitely one of my recommended resources for folks because we can be your friends critiquing the shows that you like to watch or hate to watch alongside of you. So that's pretty fun. You can add us as a trio to your friend [00:43:00] crew if you watch Adoption Pop or listen.
And you guys have so many things going on. I do, too, but I wanna make sure folks know about all of them. I'm working away at On Adoption. We are writing and editing episodes right now. It is some of the most difficult work I've ever done in my whole life because of the subject matter. I interviewed birth mothers for 18 months and hundreds of... not hundreds. Hundreds of hours of thinking about it, dozens of hours actually recording, I should say, and now putting everything together. It's very emotionally taxing, and I hope that people will really learn a lot from what we're working On Adoption. And Kristal, will you tell us about your film and your new [00:44:00] film and what you're bringing into the world in the adoptee space?
Kristal Parke: Yes. I still have my film, Because She's Adopted, out there. It's still being invited to be screened at various places and events, and we will actually be showing it at CUB this year on the 10th of October. So if you are going to CUB, come and see Because She's Adopted, and we'll do a Q&A after.
Haley Radke: That's the Concerned United Birthparents retreat. It's gonna be in Seattle, Washington this year.
Kristal Parke: Yes. Yes. And my film's also available to rent on my website, kristalparke.net. And then I kinda, I said I wasn't a real filmmaker until I did my second film. So I do my second film. It's called Life's The Mother.
It's a short film. It features Monica Hall. She's an adoptee, a first mother, [00:45:00] and she shares some very deep and personal and intimate experiences of her life. So that should be completed by the end of summer, and we'll do the film festival run. And yeah, hopefully it'll be available for everybody to see as, as soon as that's done.
And I'm actually gonna be... I have another project coming up, another doc as well, but I can't talk about it yet. So I guess if I do three docs, then I am a real filmmaker.
Haley Radke: Do you keep adding real? Yes. You're just real. Eventually it's just R-E-E-L. It's just film reels. Okay.
Kristal Parke: As you can tell, I have bad... i've got imposter syndrome big time, but that's all right.
Haley Radke: We don't have that for you. We believe you're a real filmmaker, an excellent one, and I'm so excited to see Life's a Mother when it comes out soon. And your, of course, [00:46:00] your film Because She's Adopted is incredible. Sullivan, will you share with us all the things you have going on?
Sullivan Summer: Yes, and before I do, 'cause I'm making a face at Kristal's imposter syndrome- ... that I mentioned that Adoption Pop was on YouTube. Kristal is entirely responsible for the editing and production of our YouTube show every single week, and I gotta be honest, we look fantastic. And and that's a result of Kristal every single week.
Kristal Parke: Thank you. I appreciate that. I really do. Okay, I'll never talk about myself that way again. Thank you.
Sullivan Summer: That's what, that's what we're here for.
So I have a couple of things going on. One is related, Haley, to your project On Adoption, this amazing limited series investigative podcast that you're putting together that I know [00:47:00] you've talked about before on Adoptees On.
But to produce something of the quality that you are doing costs a lot of money to do it well. And so Adoptees for Family Preservation is a 501[c][3] organization that is responsible for raising funds to support On Adoption, bringing On Adoption into the world. And we have been... so I was, I serve as the president of Adoptees for Family Preservation, alongside my other board members, Lora Alegria and Lilly Anspach.
We are all adoptees, and we've been working really hard for over a year to fundraise for On Adoption. And I have been blown away by the commitment and [00:48:00] generosity of so many people in this community who have given of their financial resources in small amounts and in large amounts to support the work that you're doing.
And so as we come into the latter half of 2026, we're in our final fundraising push and so people may see and hear us talk about fundraising more as we're coming into the end of the year. I would encourage listeners, you can go to our website adopteesffp.org. We're also on Instagram @adopteesffp. And certainly if you're able to give any amount fin- financially, we are incredibly grateful for that.
If you are not in a position to give financially, you can sign up for our [00:49:00] newsletter and you can follow us on Instagram. Both of these are free ways to support. Tell a friend also. Sign up and tell a friend as well, and again, we're grateful for that sort of support as well. So that's one thing I'm involved in.
And then I mentioned before I do quite a bit of literary criticism, but I also like... none of us, one podcast not good enough for any of us. So I also have another podcast. I have a podcast called Additions to the Archive. I interview Black authors writing Black history across genres.
That drops weekly. It is a New Books Network podcast. And so I'm really talking to historians and thinkers and people in the broader community talking about predominantly US history, politics, pop culture, literary criticism, and the like. And I will say while that is not [00:50:00] overtly adoption related, I'm thinking, Haley, when you were talking before about Adoptees On and the interviews that you're doing as being this archive of, adoptee stories.
I named my podcast Additions to the Archive because I think about a historical archive, a Black historical archive. And for me as an adopted person whose- not in reunion with either biolo- both of my biological parents were passed by the time I found them. So I have a hunger for this personal history and this archive.
And so my identity as an adoptee and as a transracial adoptee and a Black transracial adoptee is really at the foundation of Additions to the Archive, even though it is not a, quote unquote, "adoption-related podcast."
Haley Radke: Thank [00:51:00] you. I am so honored to create alongside of you two brilliant women. And, we celebrated Sullivan's chapbook launch last fall of Performance Anxiety, and I think folks would also like to read that.
We will link to all of those things in the show notes for you so you don't have to remember where to find Kristal and Sullivan. We'll have that there. But Kristal's website, kristalparke.net, and sullivansummer.com. And you're on all the places. IG, Sullivan's got a Substack. No worries, we got you covered on the links.
Thank you so much, both of you, for joining me to celebrate 10 years. Such an honor to get to speak with you and share you as my friends with all my listener friends. I'm so grateful that you agreed to come on and interview me. Thank you.
Sullivan Summer: [00:52:00] Congratulations.
Kristal Parke: Congratulations, and it is such an honor to be on Adoptees On and celebrate with you.
Love you.
Sullivan Summer: Love you.
Haley Radke: Love you too.
Thank you so much for listening to me all these years. I know there are some of you who've listened to the show since the beginning, and you've heard me evolve over the last decade, and I'm sure you have, too. And it's so incredible that you've stuck with me all these years, and I know I'm thankful for the new listeners, too.
New folks find the show every day. I hear from you that you binge the back catalog, and I love that all those hundreds of episodes are available in perpetuity. I've joked before that it's in my [00:53:00] will that someone will keep paying to keep the lights on the podcast feed when I'm long gone from this world to be able to preserve these stories for generations to come, and I hope that does happen.
I'm so proud of everyone who was brave enough to share their story and all the folks who have been inspired by my guests sharing to share in their own ways and share on Instagram and start their own TikToks and start their own podcasts and write their memoirs and workbooks to help adoptive parents and all the resources that folks have created out of listening to adoptee stories.
All the people who listened to the show and [00:54:00] went back to school to become therapists for adoptees. When I think about the ripples I'm looking at my wall of cards and letters right now. I've said it before, but whenever I'm recording at my desk, I see all the cards and notes people have sent to my PO Box, and when I have a difficult work day, I just look up, and I remember who I'm doing this for.
And I'm so Honored to be a part of such an incredible community, the adoptee community who spent, decades in activism work, and I just came alongside and learned from, all of the academics and adoptees before who have put their work out into the world. I came in as a newbie and [00:55:00] really gave myself a crash course in all that is adoption.
I don't know how many books I've read now. It's gotta be close to 300, maybe 350 adoption-related books, and all the hours of reading the academic articles that have been published, the conferences I've attended in person or virtually. If anyone wants to give me an honorary PhD in adoption, if that's a thing I think I'm ready for it.
I remember early on when somebody called me an adoptee expert, and I would kinda be like, Ugh, and now I can embrace that. I am an expert in listening to adopted people's stories, and they really stay with me, and I've carried all of your stories along with me in this world, and it powers me to [00:56:00] do the work that I'm doing now.
If you haven't heard, I'm working on this show called On Adoption. We are editing and writing the episodes right now. I've finished the majority of my recording at the time you're hearing this, and speaking to mothers who've relinquished their children is going back to how painful it was in the beginning when I heard adoptee stories and the difficulties people had and I identified with.
And now hearing the mother stories and fathers who have lost children to adoption in recent years is so deeply painful, and I have been strengthened through hearing all of your experiences and [00:57:00] knowing that there is hope for change. And I really believe that sharing our stories empowers all of us to share our stories, which impacts people's views of adoption.
And we have been changing the societal narrative together as a community for years and years, and our voices are more amplified now than they ever have been in history. And I believe that continues to happen. It continues. The amplification is growing. People are listening to us. Some are believing us.
And the more of Gen Pop, I've been calling them, that believe adoptee stories and believe stories of mothers and fathers who have [00:58:00] relinquished children, the more we will be able to support family preservation, vote for things that mean family preservation, all the upstream problems that cause adoption to happen in the first place during a temporary crisis situation.
I believe we will turn this ship around, and we are doing it. On Adoption is one of those projects that I hope will have a great impact in that work. And if you wanna learn more about it, you can go to onadoption.net. You can sign up for the Adoptees On Podcast newsletter. I share about it there, and you can look for Adoptees for Family Preservation, as Sullivan mentioned, if you'd like to support that brand-new project.
Thank you for doing that, and thank you for all the folks who have already done so. [00:59:00] You're helping power this work, this new project of mine, which will be my fourth podcast. So started with Adoptees On, went to Adoptees Off Script, which is my Patreon podcast. Now we have Adoption Pop and On Adoption's number four, and I hope to have good news about that for you soon.
Thank you to everyone who keeps asking me, "When is it gonna be out? I wanna listen to it." I wanna listen to it too. I do. I do. We're working on it, promise. Thank you so much for your celebrating with me. If you would like to give me a gift today, here are the ways you can celebrate. You can, A, tell a friend about Adoptees On, especially an adopted person that you might know. There's plenty of people who've never heard of Adoptees On. I think [01:00:00] now people assume you have, but you might not have. So tell a friend about Adoptees On. B, you could leave a podcast review. I always ask for that on my actual birthday, but this year you could leave me a review when you hear this episode. That would be so great. It helps build the credibility of the podcast and also helps people find the show a little more easily and helps in the podcast rankings of it all. And C, if you would subscribe to my newsletter and support Adoptees for Family Preservation by doing the same, that would be incredible because we will need your cheerleading and listening ears when On Adoption releases into the world to make sure it amplifies and gets out to as many folks, many listeners as we can.
[01:01:00] Those are the best ways to celebrate with me, or you can come and congratulate me on Instagram and leave a thank you for all of the guests who've shared their stories over the years. Thank you so much for listening for 10 years. Let's talk again soon.
